How Singing Heals Your Body, Mind, and Soul, with Dr. Deforia Lane

Have you ever considered why music is healing? Guest Dr. Deforia Lane has! In this episode of Grounded, you’ll hear stories from her work as a music therapist and how it has impacted her faith. Listen to the end to hear about Revive Our Hearts resources that will stir your heart to sing today! 

Episode Notes

• True Girl Online Event
• “Teach Me to Love You” video with Joy McClain
• “Summer of Surrender” playlist on YouTube
• “Summer of Surrender” playlist on Spotify
• “True Woman '22 Pre-Conference Playlist” on YouTube
• “True Woman '22 Pre-Conference Playlist” on Spotify
• “Hope Is Alive” playlist on YouTube
• “Hope Is Alive” playlist on Spotify
• “Why Should You Sing” podcast episode

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Dannah Gresh: Hey there, did you know music therapy is a form of treatment used in clinical care settings to heal both the mind and the body? Ever wonder, Does it really work? And what happens if you sing the Word of God, in the name of Jesus with that same intention? I'm Dannah Gresh. Buckle up for a powerful episode of Grounded.

Erin Davis: I'm Erin Davis. Really excited about this episode. We're here every week hanging out to things that we know you need every week, and so do, we that's hope and perspective. And if we're gonna have our perspective shifted, we need to think about things in a new way. Otherwise, we'll just have the same perspective we've always had. Today's episode is going to qualify for that many times as believers. We turn away from therapies used in behavioral science, but there's one that we should be doing as God's people, and should be doing this better than anyone else.

Dannah: Yeah, singing of course, Colossians 3:16 among a myriad of other verses, invites us to sing psalms, hymns, and spiritual songs. Aside from worshiping the Lord, have you ever wondered why there's so many words in the pages of Scripture devoted to inviting us to sing? 

Well, our guest today has some special insight. I met Dr. Deforia Lane last year, and I absolutely loved her immediately. She is a music therapist who loves Jesus and has delivered a fascinating TED talk on the power of song.

Erin: Dannah, you and I and all of our Grounded sisters know someone personally who needs that power and she needs our prayers today. I'm going to ask Portia to join us on screen. This is normally the point on the Grounded episode where we would give you some good news. But we need to deliver some difficult news this morning because someone from the Grounded family, and we are a family, and one of our family members is really hurting today. 

Portia Collins: Yeah. 

Erin: That was Ezzie you heard. Ezzie is home sick; he just coughed.

Portia: I hear a sweet little voice over there. 

Dannah: And just like that, the whole thing falls apart. 

Erin: There he is. 

Portia: Hi Ezzie. 

Dannah: There is our good news for the day.

Erin: There you go; he’s our sunshine.

07:01 - Grounded Family Update

Portia: I sure really needed that sweet little smile. I am so sad to tell you, Grounded family, that our own Robyn McKelvy suffered multiple strokes just a few weeks ago. You know Robyn and Ray. They are frequent and beloved guests here on Grounded, and so we know you will grieve and pray with us. The McKelvy’s are facing a huge struggle. Specifically, Robyn is still struggling to swallow, to talk, to walk. She has a long road of recovery ahead.

Erin: There she is healthy with her beautiful family.

Portia: There she is, and she's been surrounded by her family lately. She's now in a rehabilitation center where they are working on helping her to get back some of that basic function of talking, walking, swallowing. I just read a message from Ray from last night. He said “This week's prayer is that she can really make some headway on swallowing and walking.” 

And so y'all specifically be praying for that, but just keep them lifted up. It has been crazy for them. But God is good. He has kept her life even in spite of this. We see the grace of God. 

And so, I want to go ahead and take a minute to go ahead, and let's lift her up in prayer. 

Father, Lord, we lift up our sweet sister Robyn. We also lift up Ray and the rest of their family. This is certainly a trial, but Lord, it is not beyond Your reach. You are still on the throne. You are still with this family. You are still with Robyn. And so, Lord, we ask that You will continue to strengthen her. You know the things that lay in front of her with therapy this week, and so just help her, comfort her, comfort her heart. I know she's been very weepy lately. And so, Lord, just be with them. Help Ray and her children to continue to be strong, to be as those strong what I would call armor bearers for her in this time. Lord, we love You. We thank You. And we praise You. It’s in Jesus Christ's name that we pray, amen. 

Erin: Amen. 

Portia: Well, we love you, Robyn. We love you, Ray. And we will continue to pray that the Lord will help your family through this difficult valley.

Erin: We certainly will. And you know what? Grounded is interactive. You can use that chat feature right now or leave a comment at any time and share with the McKelvys that you love them and that you're praying for them. We'll make sure that they see that I texted Ray and said, “Can we talk about what's going on and Grounded,” and he didn't miss a beat? “Absolutely,” he said, “we want as many people praying as possible.” So let them know you love them and are praying. 

We know that not everybody is in a dark valley this morning. But some of you are some of you might be in that place that the McKelvys are in, and it feels dark and confusing. You think, I don't want to sing right now I want to cry. Maybe I want to pout. Maybe I just want to curl up in a dark room. Some valleys are so dark that it is difficult to find your song. What do you do then? If that's you, I have some insight just for you. We get grounded in God's Word. But first, I want to turn over to Dannah; she's got some really good news this morning.

11:27 - Good News (True Girl Global)

Dannah: Yeah, this is good news that I know Robyn would love and rejoice with us. It's kind of personal good news, but it's also kingdom headline stuff. Over four years ago, the Lord laid on my husband's heart a dream for our ministry, True Girl. True Girl is a ministry that provides discipleship tools for girls ages seven to twelve and their moms. One of the things we do is tour the country in our big blue tour bus. We share the gospel at all of our live events. Bob's dream was to fill the Bryce Jordan Center with girls who had come to Christ through the ministry of True Girl. 

Now, let me show you a photo of the Bryce Jordan Center. It's a 15,261 seat, multipurpose arena at Penn State University right in my backyard. 

Well, one day, Bob was considering the incredible memories that we filled in that event space at basketball games, at conferences, at concerts. He thought, Our events are so much smaller. Are we making a difference? Well, then he turned that discouragement on its head when an idea came to him. What if our small events could do something that big? And that's when he began to imagine that one day we might fill the Bryce Jordan Center with girls who came to know Christ at our events. Of course, I'm talking proverbially, not literally, but you get the idea. Well, he had the idea, audacious idea that God could use our little ministry and our miniscule team—it was four of us back then—to win 15,261 hearts for Jesus. Guess what? We did it!

I just found out moments ago. I was gonna tell you, it might happen this week. But I just found out over the weekend we hit 15,269 girls that we know of who came to Jesus at one of our True Girl events. That's where I wrote it, right there. I'm so excited. I'm so rejoicing, and I know the angels in heaven are rejoicing too. 

Since 2003, we've been presenting the gospel of Jesus at every live event and our approach is a little unique. One of us shares our testimony, and then we put mom in the driver's seat of that conversation, because we believe parents are assigned the task of spiritual mentoring, spiritual discipleship. We just provide the opportunity for mom to check in to see if her daughter really is ready to surrender her life to Jesus. And if the answer is yes, the pair come forward, together for counseling. It is a beautiful sight to see. I'm in tears every night when I'm there. 

In fact, this is a picture of me praying with a mom and her daughters at Brooklyn Tabernacle a few years ago. I am so blessed and excited. We have two more events left on our True Girl tour. This spring. I'm appearing with my True Girl tour team in Harrisburg, Pennsylvania, for the second to last pajama party this Friday night. And hey, there are two ways you can join us. Even if you don't live anywhere near Pennsylvania. You can be there live in person, of course, or you can join us online because we're live streaming it. We're hoping to have the world's largest pajama party.

We're calling it True Girl Global because we want to have girls joining us from all over the world. We have girls signed up from South Africa, Scotland, Australia, Latin America, the UK, Canada, Nigeria, we're gonna worship together, dig into God's Word, and party in our pjs. The curriculum is based on my best-selling book based on Nancy DeMoss Wolgemuth’s best-selling book Lies Women Believe. The book that the event is based on is Lies Girls Believe and the Truth that Sets Them Free. 

If you want to celebrate with me or just join me as a prayer warrior, I set up a special 50% off coupon code for my Grounded sisters. The code is “grounded.” How creative was that? Go to MyTrueGirl.com, look under “Events” for true girl global. Again, the coupon code exclusively for my Grounded is sisters is “grounded.” You'll save 50% off. Hey, I hope you'll join me, and even if you can't, will you pray with us? Because now, we're going to have to feel a football stadium. 

15:46 - Grounded with God's People (Dr. Deforia Lane)

All right, it's time to get grounded with God's people. I'm so excited about our guest today. Have you ever wondered why music changes the way you feel? Dr. Deforia Lane can tell you she's the author of music as medicine. And she is a music therapist. I met her at my alma mater Cedarville University where she's on the board of trustees. Good morning, Dr. Lane.

Dr. Deforia Lane: Good morning, Dannah. So good to see your face.

Dannah: There you are, you precious woman. I was so afraid we were praying you in because Tech was not on our side. I was just a moment ago listening to your TED Talk thinking I was going to have to be Dr. Deforia Lane.

Dr. Lane: Have merc,y have mercy.

Dannah: I am so happy to see you again. You delivered a phenomenal TED talk a few years ago on the power of music therapy. In it you told the story of the first time you cared for a baby in the NICU as a music therapist. Can you tell us that story?

Dr. Lane: The baby's mother was brought in our hospital literally brain dead. She was only about 18. She had this tiny little lump in the middle of her belly—six months pregnant. Our hospital decided to maintain her body until the baby could safely be born. And the nurses in the intensive care unit asked me if I would see the baby. And I just simply would walk in; the mother looked like Sleeping Beauty. I remember these lovely little locks of red hair. I simply put my hand over the baby over that little lump and intuitively began to sing, He’s got the whole world in His hands, He’s got the tiny little baby in His hands. 

And that baby began to dance under my fingers. I mean, it was the most compelling, exciting thing. I could feel little elbows move and little knees. I realized the baby was responding to the music. .I even speeded up what I was singing, and the baby's movements became jerky and little faster. 

I was given the opportunity to go into the operating room when she was born. When she was lifted from the womb, all three-and-a-half to four pounds of her, she did not cry. She sang in my estimation. I went to the NICU to see her. 

When babies are born too early, they desaturate their oxygen levels. They splay their fingers. They scrunch their faces. They thrust their tongues, and I would simply put my head down by the incubator and sing, He’s got the whole word, and that baby would calm. It was God's way of showing me how we are fearfully and wonderfully made.

Dannah: What a beautiful story. It is like a lullaby. I love hearing it. You say that music therapy is an evidence profession. What does that mean?

Dr. Lane: It means that we do research, literally, there are about 80 universities throughout the United States that confer a music therapy degree. And in it, we learn how the body responds to music. 

So, for example, we know that when music is heard, or participated in when you play, we are saying your whole brain is activated. And whether you want it to or not, it's just automatic. And we've seen that in MRIs, and so we can appeal to the motor center, which helps people to move and regulate their walking. Your example about your staff member who just had a stroke, we are able to use music, depending on what part of the brain has been affected, to connect it to speech, through music, through singing. 

Dannah: Wow.

Dr. Lane: It's amazing what it can do, and we are still learning.

Dannah: I just read over the weekend that inflammation which is the root cause of many of our maladies can be, there's a powerful medicinal quality to looking in someone's eyes and speaking affirmatively to them. It has as much effect as the medicines we use for fighting inflammation. Does music also help with that kind of thing?

Dr. Lane: Absolutely. My dissertation dealt with how music affects our immune system. I worked with cancer patients initially and did for the next 40 years. But one of the things that you can tell if your immune system has been increased, altered, given some strength is by something called salivary immunoglobulin A.It's in your saliva. So rather than take people's blood before and after music therapy, I took a specimen of their saliva. 

And literally after a 20-minute music therapy session, those scores for IGA shot straight up. I had a control group that I did not give music to and that did not happen. 

We know that music can allay pain, decrease your pain perception. We've seen in even labor and delivery when we use music that enables and makes you want to push strong and then lovely music that makes you want to relax. The women perceive their labor as shorter during the time with music, as opposed to the controls who did not. So, it's truly medicinal in many ways.

Dannah: Okay, now let's add to music the name of Jesus Christ, the power of worship. Is there any research on that? Or, what has been your observations been when we point our hearts to Jesus through worship music when we are either traumatized or experiencing physical ailment?

Dr. Lane: Yes, yes to all of your questions. The literature says the music that works best is what we like most. I have a tendency to tap into a person's faith to understand what it is that moves them. 

Sometimes when things aren't going to go well, I will ask what is your favorite hymn, your favorite spiritual? And once I get that and I sing it at their bedside, you can see their oxygen go up, their pulse go down, their respiration ease. You can see the musculature in their neck simply flatten and soften. 

We can call upon, ignite, remind a person to whom they belong and what they can do in a time of crisis. I've seen some beautiful restorative, a beautiful spirit, the mood changes, a person is more open and welcome. 

So, you add Jesus, and there's a certain resignation to or giving over to His way. It happens again and again. And if a person doesn't know Christ, I have often said, may I sing you something that's important to me? That opens the door. Sometimes I'll just hum it. And they'll say, “Well, what are the words? What does it mean?” And in the Lord's timing, that can be a miraculous moment.

Dannah: Wow, I know when my mom was in the hospital with a brand-new baby who was on life support, that it was a visit from a pastor who shared the gospel with her that turned her heart. Our hearts are extremely sensitive to the Lord in that kind of need. 

Dr. Lane, none of us have the degree that you have in music therapy. So, coach us up. How can we as women use music to minister to say, Robin McKelvy, our friend who's healing from a stroke? Or maybe it's a friend at home who is pregnant and on bedrest, or maybe it's a baby that's in the NICU? Maybe it's an older mother or father suffering from dementia? What should we do to use music well, to encourage their bodies to heal?

Dr. Lane: Let's start with dementia, just because my mind doesn't hold things too long. So, with dementia, bringing songs, playing them in the background, or singing them, that person knows, will, because our long-term memory is usually in there, it's just how do you tap it? So, playing it at mealtime, playing it and talking about it, they usually will stay longer, eat more. 

With your friend Robyn, to me, this is a time to bring in music that she loves. And that is encouraging in its nature, “Have a Little Talk with Jesus,” or “Blessed Assurance, Jesus Is Mine.” So, reminding her of whose she is. 

Or taking the words out of the natural music. I had a 25-year-old who had the capability mentally of a 12-year-old. She wanted her family to know Jesus. She said her favorite song was “Jesus Loves Me.” So, we took out the words and left the chorus intact. But we put her words of what she wanted for her family in that and her testimony about how the Lord had healed her. 

So, bringing a song to someone, even better, singing a song to someone . . . If you can't sing, it'll be a good laugh. But you know that the intent of the heart will be there. 

And when Robyn begins to use her arms and hands and motor wise, the rhythm of the music can be an entertainment for her. And the number of repetitions will probably increase too. And if it's a hymn or an anthem, hallelujah, it will go even further. 

If indeed the camaraderie of family singing together with her, that will be amazing as well. Just let the Lord lead in how and when and how long. You do something with a person; you don't want to tire her out. But believe me, the music can bring energy to her as well.

Dannah: I love that. I want to put you on a plane and fly you right down to Robyn McKelvy to sing over. I think I'll show up to you so you can sing over me. What a joy you are. Dr. Deforia Lane, I am so honored to know you. The name of Dr. Deforia’s book is Music as Medicine and her TED talk, we're gonna put a link in the show notes and comments of YouTube and Facebook so you can find it. You're gonna want to listen to it over and over. It's fantastic. Thank you for being with us today. Dr. Lane.

Dr. Lane: Thank you for the opportunity, Dannah. God bless you and your ministry. 

Dannah: You too. 

29:51 - Grounded in God's Word (Luke 19:35–40)

Erin: Well, we're going to stay grounded in God's Word like we like to do. Many of you know my mom is in a nursing home as she's fighting dementia. And intuitively when I leave the room, I always say, Alexa, play worship music, and there's a little Alexa in her room that starts to sing. 

Dannah: I love it. 

Erin: We're going to take her advice. We're going to see what God's Word has to say about it. So go ahead and grab your Bibles. 

You might not really even know it, but you've already been to an orchestra concert today. Before the sun came up, I was up prepping and praying about this episode. And as the sun started to rise on the horizon, I did something that I don't do most mornings and wish I did more often. And that is, I paid attention. 

And what was happening outside was such an easy connection to what I knew we'd be talking about this morning. The birds and bugs and every other creature was doing what they do every morning as the sun rises, they were singing.

I was reminded of a story found in the Gospel of Luke. So, let's look at Luke chapter 19, verses 35–40 together. I always like to remind us that every text is part of a context here. And the context here is the triumphal entry. I'm sure you know that story. Jesus knew He was on his way to the cross. The people didn't understand what was happening yet. And so they were celebrating Him coming into Jerusalem,. We will pick it up at Luke chapter 19, verse 35. 

And they brought it to Jesus, and throwing their cloaks on the colt, they set Jesus on it. And as he rode along, they spread their cloaks on the road. As he was drawing near—already on the way down the Mount of Olives—the whole multitude of his disciples began to rejoice and praise God with a loud voice for all the mighty works that they had seen.

Now, it doesn't say they were singing. But I think they were rejoicing loudly. They're using their voices at full volume. They're declaring who God is, or who they think He is. 

Verse 38, saying, 

“Blessed is the King who comes in the name of the Lord! Peace in heaven and glory in the highest!” And some of the Pharisees in the crowd said to him, to Jesus, “Teacher, rebuke your disciples.” He answered, “I tell you, if these were silent, the very stones would cry out.” 

Three quick observations from this familiar passage: one, singing is a natural response to all that God has done. We see it again there in verse 37, the whole crowd of the disciples began to praise God joyfully with a loud voice, for all the miracles they had seen. This is where when we tell this story, we tell about them saying Hosanna and celebrating His arrival. And if it feels like this morning, or at any point in your life, it feels like life has stolen your song, you just can't sing, you don't have a song in your heart anymore. I think that's worth paying attention to. 

It is like so many things, a warning light on the dashboard of your life. And what that warning light is saying is if you just can't come up with a song, you cannot just sing, there's no song left in you, the warning light is saying stop and recount all that the Lord has done for you. 

And it won't take you long. I know this without knowing you that God has done many amazing things in your life and in mine. And when we start to intentionally recount those, a song is going to begin to well up inside of us again. 

The second thing I notice in this passage is that singing is countercultural. Now, obviously we live in a culture that loves to sing. We live in a culture that loves music, but we're talking about the kind of healing singing Dr. Lane was talking about. We're talking about singing directed towards God. That's countercultural. 

The religious leaders were irritated that the people were singing joyfully, verse 39, “Teacher, rebuke your disciples.” In other words, this is getting out of hand. These people just sound silly. Don't they know there's a lot more serious things going on, and here they are just singing. Isn't there a more serious way that your disciples could be showing their devotion? I'm reading a lot between the lines there. But we know the Pharisees, we know how irritated they were when things didn't fit into their neat tidy box of who God should be, and it made them mad. 

So, it made me think what if part of our Christian witness to the world is singing in the darkness? What if part of the way we showcase the gospel today and every day is that we sing when things don't go well?

Remember Paul and Silas in prison? They were shackled together, and what were they doing? Singing. And the guards were like, “What is happening?” This is weird. It is weird. It's countercultural. 

What do we sing when things go well, and when they don't? If we do, we should know that it's true. It will irritate, but it will also showcase that we have a hope and a joy that bubbles out of our hearts out of our mouths, no matter what we're facing. 

The third thing I noticed in this passage is that you were made to sing. Now, when Dr. Lane was singing, she clearly has been given a musical gift. She sounded like Sleeping Beauty when she was singing. I don't have that particular gift. But I was made to sing nonetheless. How do I know that? Because all of creation is singing. Right now, in a spring bursting forth where I live, the birds just sing all day long, like it's their job. Well, that's because it is their job. They're supposed to glorify God with those little bird voices that he's given them. 

The trees are singing as they sway in the breeze. Nobody has to tell them to do that. There's no Maestro with this one teaching them how to sing. They're just made to sing. And Jesus said as the religious leaders were rolling their eyes about people singing about Jesus. He said that if the people made in the image of God don't sing, the rocks are going to start singing in our place.

We used to sing this little song when I was a child in children's church, “Ain't no rock going to cry in my place, as long as I’m alive I’m going to glorify His Holy name.”

I won't sing the whole thing for you, but it came back to me as I was thinking about this. It's like a resolution. I don't know, let a rock sing the praises that I was made to sing. Jesus was saying if My people don't do it, the rocks will, because that's what I made them to do. 

So, I hope one of your takeaways from this episode is that you're gonna do what you were made to do today, and you were made to sing, and not just sing your favorite song. There are songs I love that have nothing to do with Jesus. 

But you were made to sing praises to the Lord, to sing about the things He's done for you, to sing about the things He's going to do, to sing about the things He's promised to sing about—who He is—to sing about His faithfulness. I want you to just commit that you're not gonna let any rock take your place in the choir of God. 

One more passage of Scripture that has been so meaningful in my life for about the past two years as I've walked through a really long valley of stress and sorrow (I've shared some of that here with you) is Psalm 92. It has become a psalm that I have clung to. By the way, as you go through the Psalms, you'll see how many of them are songs that King David and other psalmists wrote to force their hearts to do what they were made to do, which is sing.

But Psalm 92, verse 1 says this: “It is good to give thanks to the LORD, to sing praises to your name, O Most High.”

Now, I've always read that and thought singing is a good thing to do. And it is a good thing to do. It's a way that we can showcase our hope that doesn't require any special gifts or any money. We can all sing or hum or make music in some way to glorify God. But as I've been soaking in Psalm 92, what's been clear to me and what Dr. Lane was telling us is, that singing is just not just a good thing to do. Creation knows that. Creation also knows it's a good thing to do, and it's good for you. 

Creation knows because it cannot wait for the sun to rise so it can burst into song every day. How about you? It's good for you at a neurochemical level in ways that can be measured in an MRI. Singing is good for you. Are you happy? You should say it's good for you. Are you tired? You should sing. It will help your body rest. Are you worried? You should sing. Are you angry? You should sing. Are you sad? You should sing. Another song that I sing a lot when I'm cleaning my house when it just feels endless is: 

Why so downcast oh my soul,
Put your hope in God,
Put your hoping God,
Put your hope in God.
Oh why so downcast oh my soul,
Put your hope in God
And bless the Lord oh my soul.

Try being grumpy and singing that song. I bet you can't do it. So, sing for all God is and sing for all God does and sing today because that's what God made you to do. Portia, you're the singer in this group if you want to sing to us, you can.

Portia: And I say to that amen. 

Erin: Thank you, sister. That was so good. 

Portia: Amen to everything. I'm gonna be singing to myself all day today. 

Erin: Me too. 

Portia: Okay, thank you. Thank you. Well guys, you know that we love to tell you the good stuff, to give you the good stuff, and Revive Our Hearts has a sale that is starting today. So, think about gifts for Mother's Day. We have everything. Think about graduations coming up. We've got everything for everybody. From wall hangings, to jewelry, to books, resources. Listen, man, can I encourage you to give a meaningful gift this year? Check it out it ReviveOurHearts.com/sale 

Also, and I don't know if you know, this keeping in line with our singing theme today. Revive Our Hearts has some great playlists to keep you singing all year round. We've got a summer playlist on surrender. We've got a playlist from our last conference True Woman 2022. We've even got a Christmas playlist, because it is never too early to start singing Christmas tunes, you know? 

So all of these playlists are free. You can check them out on the Revive Our Hearts YouTube channel, or we also have Spotify links. If you'd like to listen to your music on Spotify, we're gonna drop those links. II encourage you to check them out. 

Also, one more thing. You know, we gotta lay the good stuff on thick. I want to point you to the Revive Our Hearts episode titled, “Why Should You Sing?” In that episode our very own Nancy DeMoss Wolgemuth says “Christians ought to be singing people.” And so, I want you to go find out why. We'll drop a link to that episode in the chat and the show notes.

Dannah: Okay, I have heard of Christmas in July, but Christmas in April is a new one. We're starting new trends here on Grounded.

Portia: I’ve actually heard of Christmas in April. 

Erin: Yeah, Christmas all the time. 

Dannah: I have got to first correct the name of Dr. Lane’s book. This is my brain. Me and my brain turn things around. It's not medicine as music. It's Music as Medicine. I think you'd probably find it if you Googled my mistake.

But guys, the comments today are so exciting to me. Can I just read a few of them to you? You know how our girls encourage each other, right? Debbie wrote “Patricia, this is what you are doing for Thelma,” look at that. One of our Grounded sisters doing the ministry of music with Thelma, so we're praying for you today. That’s beautiful. 

Erin: Yeah. 

Dannah: And then this, I had a lump in my throat on this one. Cindy Anderson wrote, “Thank you so much for sharing with us. It helps me understand better why I went back to playing the piano when my beloved died.”

Erin: It's a grief. I mean, grief isn't bad, but it is. It's an antidote to grieve in a way to move through the grief in ways that are helpful. I love that. 

Dannah: Yeah. I just love how they're talking about how they have used music. They've seen it work. It's a beautiful conversation. Keep having that conversation. We watch it. We get excited. We pray over. We're going to be praying for Thelma today. 

Erin: That's right. Several of you're asking how you could send a card to Robyn and Ray. We'd love that. We don't want to blast their address out here on the internet. So, we will work on a way to get you connected them. But they definitely can follow up and watch anything you leave in the chats or in the comments of this episode on Facebook or YouTube. We're gonna send them this episode. I want them to hear Dr. Lane’s advice, wise advice. We definitely want them to know that you've got them there, and we'll work on another way.

Dannah: Who knew we were gonna have a concert today? Everyone's saying, except me. I did not.

Erin: I was going to say, “Did Dannah sing?”

Dannah: I shall not. 

Portia: Your turn. 

Dannah: I am the audience today.

Erin: I appreciate it. I appreciate it. I can't believe I sang. I will look back at this go, “Erin Davis, what were you thinking?” 

Dannah: You did great.

Join us next week. We are calling next week's episode “A Christian Woman's Guide to Menopause.” Whoa, we're gonna go there. And listen, if you're in your thirties, don't think you're too young, because perimenopause can start in those years. You are going to have some great advice from, get this, our guest’s name is Dannah. There's another one of us. Dannah Dmitri will be with us next week.

Portia: Love it. Looking forward to it. Well, as we say goodbye, we want to send you out singing, and so we have a treat for you. I've told you many times how I grew up with my mama who played the organ and my grandma who played the piano and music pretty much has always been a part of my life. In fact, my grandfather was a band director for a nearby University. So music is just life for me. But as an adult, I am still learning how God can specifically use music to make me to make us more like him. So, I want you to listen to this beautiful song from your prayer warrior Joy McClain. Joy leads the Grounded prayer team and if possible, stop what you do and if you're busy, stop what you're doing and pause and let God stir your heart for a few moments through song.

Dannah: Grounded audio is powered by Skype. Grounded is a production of Revive Our Hearts calling women to freedom, fullness, and fruitfulness in Christ.

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